Sunday, September 17

no, I am not going to fall into this trap (lap)

As you can imagine I have a bundle of opinions about the pope and the reaction to his speeches.

Aside from that particular issue, or shall I say adjoined to it ... it is striking to observe how - shall I say how oversensitized people have become these days. You can't say diddely shit anymore, can't have an opinion about anything without getting bashed as political incorrect, religious insensitive, socially inept, abusive, retarded or rude ... and so on.

We live in a world where the mute button rules.

Take the risk to speak out, always - despite all obstacles!


reverb said...

..control de las masas... masses control

if not, a total chaos occurs...

Zee said...

You sound like Solovief, a turn of the century philosopher Reverb.

reverb said...

...well many books about this topic was wroted by those years...

reverb said...

...hey Zee, I see that you relapse in your own lovely perfil...ha ha

Madcap said...

Hi Zee, finally commenting after reading for so long...

This matter is making me a little crazy. For the love of the gods, who CARES what he says? Certainly not most of the Catholics I know. It's not as if he has any power anyway. All this hoopla is just opportunism on the part of Muslim extremists to stir people up and incite them to violent acts.

And on the other hand, what the hell is Benny playing at? He knows full well what he's saying and how it's likely to be used. Interesting, explosive little game going on here, on both sides...

Lindsay Lobe said...

Pope Benedict is an “intellectual’ a previous incumbent from the Curia, but with his appointment to the papacy, now attempts to “engage” with free thinking. His remarks arose at a university gathering in Germany, to stimulate and enlighten. Perhaps he has become far too open, wishing to engage and pose questions to make people think, far too clever for his own good!!(Or mans chosen god!!)

The talk he gave was on the 3 stages of De-Hellenisation, his idea a belief in god is consistent with human reason and Greek philosophical inquiry; that is we can achieve an improvement in ourselves and our civilisations, by using reason, consistent with the true nature of religion.
He went on to quote a series of dialogues between a learned 14th century Byzantine emperor and a scholarly Persian Muslim about the true nature of their religions. Suffice to say he merely “quoted” what was said, the objective to show the need to link human reason and oppose the violent alternative, that is to spread the religion by the use of the sword. That’s no different to violence of the “Crusaders “who in the absence of any human reasoning, felt justified in their actions to regain the holy lands.
The Pope was not attacking the Muslim religion at all; rather he was upholding the need for human reason and philosophy as to the true nature of religion.

Personally to me its seems a very sad state of affairs that you cannot have a conversation, with only the barest crititicism (by including a 14th century quote) of an interpretation of an aspect of "Islam" without creating a fury.
The Pope has all clearly defined his own thinking on a number of aspects, he was sympathetic to the reaction to the Danish cartoons, opposed the conflict in Lebanon, and the war in Iraq.
Best wishes

Maliha said...

Zee I have mixed feelings over this issue and that's why I still can't think of what i want to say.

The Muslim reaction is predictable and makes me mad; because while some are reaching out in a calm way to talk and open doors of dialogue; others are just going nuts...

The pope made me mad too; because I don't believe in just unchecked freedom Zee. In his position, a religious leader, should have more tact, diplomacy and a dose of responsibility. Freedom without responsibility and foresight is meaningless.

Zee it doesn't have to be all or nothing. The mute button or the loud strident voices of every crazy person out there. Can we have civilized discourse, that simply binds us to our sheer humanity?

It's really not that hard.

Peace to you.

Maliha said...

Did you notice how the media had a field day with the few Muslims that went out there to make violent protests?

I hate that; i hate that the few who present the "violent" face always get the most media attention...sensational boo haw.

Zee said...

As always, thanks for your comments Maliha - they are appreciated greatly!
I agree with you that the media is onesided and tainted.
I have my narrow preconceptions as well when we start talking about Islam, my issues, my simplifications, my euro-centric view on history, my tendency to see black&white. Said all this, your comments make me scratch my head and back off somewhat. I am open to explore ... believe it or not!
On purpose I did not say anything about the Pope. I just sit there and watch the dispute with bewilderment. I do not belong to catholics, protestants or any other church configuration.
For me spirituality is a temple within, no matter what path one has chosen

Maliha said...

Salamaat ya Zee,
"believe it or not"...of course i believe you zee. You are open; i can tell in your posts and more importantly you are self-aware...which is a rare but precious trait in a human being.

It shouldn't matter what path one chooses; I believe what's inside really matters; and walking this particular path i choose; helps me preserve that sacred space within using the tools that give me form/discipline.

but isn't this the beauty of free-will and freedom?

The ability to say “I have found the truth,” but rather, ”I have found a truth.”

Say not, ” I have found the path of the soul.” Say rather, ” I have met the soul walking upon my path.”

For the soul walks upon all paths. The soul unfolds itself, like a lotus of countless petals. "


I hope you are having a scrumptious day; peace to you.

ian russell said...

if his holiness is an example of an ''intellectual'' then I'm glad I'm not one - common sense (one ounce of which must surely be worth ten of intellectual reasoning) tells you if you tease a cat it may scratch you and not to be surprised if it does.

personally, i'm praying to god each day for an end to all religion. maybe santa claus will bring it this year...

Benny's got the most unholy eyes i've ever seen on a man of god in a long while.

Maliha said...

Salamaat Ian,
I think scapegoating religion is a common yet fatal mistake.

Religion simply gives people a worldview and some set of tools to live their lives.

Everyone has a worldview...even athiest.

Some great crimes were committed under the name of Communism and greater still are being committed in the lofty name of "democracy" and "freedom".

Men use whatever is at their disposal to justify their crimes; and religion happens to be one of them.

I pray for the end of Injustice and Corruption; and if Santa can manage that; I might just have to go to the north pole and marry him...myself :)

Peace to you:)

Zee said...

I'll be hopefully invited to your wedding Maliha - I'm sure it will be a fine celebration, a blast ... as they say here.

Why get offensive about the pope, there is no use in that. He is basically an old guy brought up in a different world than mine. Who cares, I mean really: Who cares!?!

Whoever gets upset about this just shows that they are still living in a world of theocratic belief overruling the the fiber of societal fabric.
Religion does not belong into politics!

Gary said...

You're right, we're all so ready to get excited over words.

But if you're the Pope, you have to know that what you say will have an effect. He was dumb.

For example, if I was Pope, I might say something like:

"Jesus was just a guy like you and me, but he was pretty cool and hit the right time. The whole church deal is really more about power and superstition than him.

But I really love my hats and when I was younger, I had a real thing for altar boys."

How about that for free speech!

twodogsbarking said...

As a semi-Catholic, I rarely care what the pope says. I must say though when I covered John Paul's visit to San Francisco for my college newspaper, just his riding by in the popemobile totally awed me. I was so shocked by my reaction and by the crowd's reaction. They, too, were joking around irreverent as heck until he appeared. Then this hush fell over the crowd -- it was incredible the effect he had on us. I still remember it like it was this morning. As for the comments this pope made, well, it's unfortunate, and I don't think John Paul would have made them. There is no much hatred and taking things out of context now that I have learned unless I'm in the emotional mood to "take it" I keep my opinions to myself unless I blog it where I can moderate comments. Is that fair? Who cares.

AM said...

Haha so true!
Dude, you cannot even blog your own opinion on your own blog without being bashed either.
Freedome of speech?
Forget that, let's try and save the freedom of opinion first.